Comments on Hit Self-Destruct: The Crying Contest

I personally think there have been good video game...

2008-09-14T14:42:00.000+12:00

I personally think there have been good video game stories, good enough to feel a lot of emotion over their high points. The thing is, that is more the medium of storytelling (or "narrative" or "narratology") - be it literature, pictures, comics, films, music, or anything else.

I think artistically, pure gameplay is already art - and has really always been art - but that's just my opinion :) Immature or not, that's just the case I think.

Now, the games that effectively combine the gameplay and story so the high points of such are an extension of both are special cases, perhaps more the intent here? They've probably not reach the potential (there isn't a lot of emergent gameplay storytelling, or dynamic ones based on gameplay decisions).

Interesting post. I've had a few game moments I've been quite sad at and had a tear in my eye, but the same with other media, although games are usually more special for the interaction involved even if it is only between the cutscenes.

qrter: yeah I really think it's a question people ...

2008-09-12T17:08:00.000+12:00

qrter: yeah I really think it's a question people only ever ask because of the medium's relative immaturity, like they're checking in to see if it's living up to its potential. The crying question is a cliche but it's a benchmark people use, at least rhetorically. But the answer to it is obviously yes and as you say it makes no sense anyway.

Matthew: I completely agree with you, I've never t...

2008-09-12T17:03:00.000+12:00

Matthew: I completely agree with you, I've never thought that games making players cry elevates the medium to high art or whatever. As you say, it's a technique the soap opera has easily mastered. I think that's my point, though: behind the question "can a video game make you cry" is the insinuation that if not, video game writing isn't even up to a soap opera level of sophistication.

Also, anonymous: the Kirkland mention was a joke, a reference to
this. And I'll bet that some people teared up at Mafia, although in retrospect I should have put Agro '05.

I think the point is that games as they are now do...

2008-09-12T17:01:00.000+12:00

I think the point is that games as they are now don't naturally lend themselves to eliciting emotions that make the player cry, while other media have an easier time on that point.

The comparison to other media in this regard seems false and senseless.

It would be like saying a film isn't art because it doesn't give a sense of exploration and general accomplishment to the public. That's just not within the means of cinema, it would be silly to expect it to.

@matthew.

I agree to a point. The fact tha...

2008-09-12T05:26:00.000+12:00

@matthew.

I agree to a point. The fact that a scene made you cry could be affected by dozens of external (and non-related) factors.

But that leaves the game's scene as one of two possibilities:
a) the scene acted as the catalyst that made you release these independent and unrelated feelings.
b) the scene made you cry because it connected to something about you (you're sensitive, your past allows you to relate to the scene, etc).

in either case, the game succeeded. maybe not as art, but in its original purpose: interactive recreation. you played the game, the story progressed, the game delivered emotional content, and you reacted emotionally to that content.

now how to define "games" or "gameplay" as an artform? well I guess that's up to smarter people than myself. But if I were to take a stab at it; I'd suggest that artform is achieved when that activity excels at it's purpose.

When you feel that 'jolt' of emmotion from a great song/piece, a scene from a movie/game/book/opera/theater, or are just awestruck from a painting or sculpture.

The fact that a game has made you cry does not the...

2008-09-12T03:10:00.000+12:00

The fact that a game has made you cry does not therefore mean it is "serious" or "art". All kinds of things make people cry: soap operas on television, dime-store romance novels, intense physical pain, a day that just didn't go right. I of course understand the desire to claim the throne of artistic legitimacy, but "it made me cry!" is not the way to go about doing it, in my mind.

Really? Kirkland? Tommy Angelo? And I thought I...

2008-09-12T03:09:00.000+12:00

Really? Kirkland? Tommy Angelo? And I thought I was a wuss for crying at Aeris.

I'm just teasing you of course. But it wouldn't be funny if it weren't partly true.